The Nürburgring Diaries Archives Volume X

[vitg]

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/12/2005 10:47:05 AM |

I read J.W. Hubbers website frequently. www.jwhubbers.nl/ring/index.php

Old timers might remember that he checked us out in the Spring. In his trip
reports, he sometimes refers to "Bastard Bend," which is somewhere on the 'Ring.
Anybody have any idea where that is?

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/12/2005 10:52:47 AM |

Oh, and before I forget about it again, did you catch this column from Autoweek
a while back.

www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=102873

Hmm...think he might lurk?

From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/12/2005 11:46:02 AM |

The Group C Jag? Sounds good. It can be bought, too, so 50% isn't absolutely
necessary. Will try it.

WR hint 2:
If the Speedster is Light Coke, this one would be Jolt Cola.
---

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/12/2005 12:04:10 PM |

Oh heh didn't know it could be bought.
---

From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/12/2005 1:07:57 PM |

From the posted link:

But this is still the place where Niki Lauda cooked his face. And Jackie Stewart
called it the “Green Hell.” Jackie Stewart! Its 73 corners—spread over 13 miles
of uneven concrete and curbing and elevation changes—were deemed so dangerous
Formula One hasn’t raced there in nearly three decades.

Hmmm...Sounds familiar. I think you should sue him for plagiarism, Amar!
---

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/12/2005 1:46:07 PM |
What if that is Amarynceus...
---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/12/2005 3:11:10 PM |

Whew, been a while,

I nead some clarifacation on the RR, It must be the XJR-9 Race car '88, not
XJR-1. Correct? Also the HP on mine is 928, and the one on the lot is 700 and
some? Either way good choice viper.

Only 1 day of work left and I'll be able to get some posting in, mostly am. Will
get some time in tonight on the XJR.
---
GT4 100% complete, 100% win ratio

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/12/2005 3:39:42 PM |

Yeah the XJR 9. That’s what I get for posting without having my game around(at
work).
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/12/2005 4:27:04 PM |

Would the bastard bend be the sharp left after the start/finish line?

Just a guess.

I love that Jaguar race car, it's how I passed the Sarthe test for the S
license. It was the fastest car I had to practice with/learn the track (the test
is in the Bentley).

I'm not normally a fan of superfast cars on the 'Ring, but sometimes, it's
necessary.

Peace.
---
For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will
be the coming of the Son of Man. Matthew 24:27

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/12/2005 8:01:02 PM |

Did that guy ever specifically mention us on his page? I'm too tired right now
to read through that entire site.

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/12/2005 8:02:18 PM |

And by "us" I simply mean the diary, since that was probably before I started
reading these topics.
---
Insert clever quip here


From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/12/2005 8:13:04 PM |

It's a short article.. but no it does not mention us.

---

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/12/2005 8:44:44 PM |

well, I read the page he directly linked to, but there were a number of articles
along the left side, and I thought one of those might be what he was referring
to by "checked us out". Otherwise I'm misunderstanding what he meant. I should
probably sleep. Maybe it'll make more sense to me in the morning.

---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/13/2005 4:34:32 AM |
Flibutz, is it the Saleen?

---

From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/13/2005 4:51:46 AM |

RR:

The Jaguar XJR-9 is listed as 7xx hp but it actually has over 900. Just like the
Pescarolos are listed as 5xx hp while having more when you buy them.

Excellent Choice, viper! My Jag had around 70km on it, and that was done a loong
time ago (it had ASM on!). It is just as stable as promised, maybe stabler. But
it felt like it would only turn well with throttle on. I'd almost call it
lift-throttle understeer.

To combat this, I dropped the LSD decel to 8. Then it handled pretty much like I
wanted to. That kind of move in a group C car usually leads to stability
problems. Not with this one. Still stable as a rock! Furthermore, I softened the
shocks a bit. (Front 6b/8r - rear 7b/7r) More suspension tuning could probably
make it faster, but I'm not very good at it so I didn't dare to touch anything
else. And I didn't know which direction I wanted to go. If you have any
suggestions about suspension settings, I'd like to try them.

The Jag has a remarkable ability to recover from hopeless looking situations.
More than once I thought that I had lost it, but the car seemed to just clear
the situation all by itself. I did lose it several times, but couldn't blame
that on the car. I used TCS@5, but still had a subtle throttle oversteer on 2nd
gear and some on the 3rd.

Best lap: 5'36.646

Overall I'd prefer this one over the 787B any day, at least on the 'Ring. Yes,
the 787B might be a tiny bit faster but average laptime for me is much worse.

WR hint 3:

The basic idea behind the car somewhat resembles that of the AC 427.

While it's a fast car, it's not fast enough to be competitive with the likes of
Saleen. And it's much less expensive. But it does have something in common with
the Saleen, in addition to the MR layout.

---
From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/13/2005 6:37:33 AM |

Greetings from Oz to all the returning Ringers, I am only new here myself but am
totally obsessed, it is great fun. Special G'day to Sackedagain for starting
what is the best thread anywhere.
Mr. Pinstripes – Happy Birthday, sounds like you scored well with the prezzies,
I think you will enjoy GT2, I recently revisited GT1&2 which is what inspired me
to buy a PS2 / GT4. If you want a challenge, see how far you can go with your
first car, I started with the Honda CRX 1.6 Vtec and ended up punching well
above my weight in a lot of races. Dont worry about the Cake ( I am on a seafood
diet at the moment.
I see food, I eat it )

WanderingMuse - thanks for pointing out the other baby MR cars, I am getting
quite a collection together now, I am also hoping to get some more practice in
the Ford GT cars this weekend, beautiful machinery!!
Muse, another trick to use when sorting out a corner is to do the backwards and
forwards thing but do it in photo mode so you can have a look through the camera
it might help( it helped me ).
I have been following for some time a certain topic which has intrigued me, this
has led me to buy three specific cars( nuff said ) I will report on my efforts
after this weekends assignments.

RR™
Jaguar XJR9 – This thing pulls like a Train, another top notch MR car, although
a bit of a handful straight out of the box. I have not played around with the
tuning yet but will probably be able to improve on my stock times with a bit of
judicious tweaking.
First lap very dirty @ 6 ' 29.488 , braking far too late but still achieving
some scary exit speeds. Second lap improved slightly and a bit tidier, braking
earlier or just coasting a bit before the braking point got me to a 6 ' 20.968
Only two laps so far, looking forward to the weekend.

WR™
Callaway?

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:06:30 AM |

The Jag has a remarkable ability to recover from hopeless looking situations.
More than once I thought that I had lost it, but the car seemed to just clear
the situation all by itself.

This was what made me fall in love with the Jag, it was the first car I drove on
the Ring where I felt like I could really throw it around the track and feel
confident that I could recover if I made a mistake. And man can it fly...
---

From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:26:13 AM |

WR:
I'm sorry to jump the gun on this, but something unexpected came up and I don't
know when I'll be online next time. Thursday is still better than saturday or
sunday, right?

The american horsepower ment literally just that, the car is not american.
That's what I ment when comparing it to the AC. And both have Ford V8 engines,
as does the Saleen. That said, my pick is the:

Proto Motors Spirra 4.6 V8

Hope you like it. Those of you who like to save replays will, for sure.

Whoa, look at the time, I gotta run. I'll see y'all in a couple of days. Happy
'Ringin'!
---

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/13/2005 9:48:27 AM |

Haven’t posted anything of substance since March 31, just before I headed to
Kiawah Island for a week. Things went haywire shortly after my return. I worked
in a two-man criminal law office, run by a legend with 30 plus years of
experience. We were in court daily on multiple cases. He went out sick in
mid-April and had a stroke in May. Never returned. In August, we closed the
office and I had to set up a new place. Tough times, but I’m seeing daylight
now.
The Diary kept me in touch with GT4, though I posted to simply tag the thread.
Yesterday, I checked out one of Amarynceus‘s links and printed off the
eurocircuit guide to the Ring. I took it with me to the Mazda dealer, where I
had some maintenance done on the Miata. By the time I left the dealer—with more
horsepower, damn that air filter was dirty—I was ready to race.

But, got home and found myself charged with dinner duty, so GT4 had to wait.
Opened a bottle of Spanish wine, a cheap Jumillia, and made a rosemary and
garlic rub for two Icelandic lamb chops. Lit the Viking up and browned the chops
on the stove top in the fat from a single slice of bacon. Took the chops off
when they were lightly pink inside and deglazed the pan in a dry white wine with
thinly chopped onions and garlic. Wife loved the sauce and ate most of the lamb,
one of my favorites but not hers.

The entire time, I’m checking out the circuit guide and itching to turn on the
PS2. But, instead, she decides she’s too tired to do anything but watch Tivo
recordings on the television that shares the PS2. Around 10:30, I’m dead asleep
in front of a West Wing from last year. No Ring time.

Dark October morning and dark coffee. At the Mazda dealership, a salesman had
pimped the MazdaSpeed6 that’s due sometime next month. Tuned up suspension, AWD
and turbo-charged. I checked the GT4 Mazda lot for something similar and, not
finding anything, settled on the Mazda6 Touring Car. I figured it would be easy
to handle as I shook the rust off my modest Ring skills.

A fast car, but tame to a fault. Difficult to make a mistake in it. I did four
laps without an error. Kept my eyes up and felt very comfortable by the end.
Fastest lap was a 7:37.

With another 30 minutes before I had to take the dog for his daily, I pulled the
’89 Miata out of the garage. At 110 HP, brakes seem unnecessary in the Miata. I
feather them now and then, but momentum is critical. The roadster is fabulous
sideways and, unlike the touring car, very easy to spin (Adenauer Forst), throw
into a wall (Breidsheid) and dump into the litter (Schwalbenschawn ??). Great
fun though. Managed a clean lap of 9:20.

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/13/2005 11:49:11 AM
Ah, the Spirra is a fun car.

I've got two already.
Can't remember my times, I think it might have been a 7'50 car.

[vitg]

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/13/2005 3:20:15 PM |
Onikaze said:

"Ah, the Spirra is a fun car."
For newcomers, that's not a compliment to the car as much as it is a warning to
grip drivers that the Spirra drifts.
All my RUF time (CTR2 and RGT) the past two weeks is well served in the Spirra:
sliding around and steering with pedals, this is a fast, fun car. I don't have a
lap time yet because in my only lap I wrecked in the slowdown bends leading up
to the finish line, but I like the Spirra a lot.

Good job on your clues Flibutz, I was stumped.

Don't be afraid of the back end coming out, as trying to avoid it causes more
trouble than it saves.

Sackedagain, thank you for sharing. I missed the early versions of the diary,
but your writing and sense of detail are excellent and appreciated.

Viper, I'm glad you liked the little MR's. It seems they should have their own
word, like burrito. MRitos? Nah. But surely there's a word in someone's language
that fits perfectly.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/13/2005 3:48:49 PM |
Little MR's are what sports cars are meant to be.

Just pure, unadulterated, fun.

Oh, that is very accurate muse, I love this car, the way the tail begs to be let
loose to smoke the tires up is glorious.

Sounds nice, looks great, goes fast, slides forever.
It kinda reminds me of what would happen if a Ferrari 348, a Honda NSX, and a
Ford Mustang had a drunken threeway...

Or maybe if Ford bought Ferrari and Honda, and got Senna to help them make a MR
sports car, this is what would have happened.

Great car either way, ran an 8'07.095....on N3's...sideways most of the lap.
Tip for this specific car: go VERY deep into the corners, but don't carry too
much speed, try to kiss the apex with the inside front tire, and if it looks
like you are going to push wide, let off the throttle, the tail will slide
around smoothly, and then it's a matter of massaging the gas and applying smooth
countersteer.
When you want to get it straight again, WHIP the wheel fast, don't be gentle
with it, or it will come around, rape your women, and pillage your village, to
steal a sig quote.

I come out with the wheel canted off to one side, and then I tap the brakes to
pull the weight forwards, ease off the throttle but never lift fully, and then
saw the wheel right back straight.

It's like a balancing act, you'll feel it, anything off center and the tail
wants to come around that way too, go back off center when you correct and it
will come right around that way.

Very fun car.


From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/13/2005 5:20:20 PM |

Yea this car is definitely awesome. I'm not one to be daring and use N2's or
anything (actually I was too lazy to get them from the dealer). My first lap
with it had a few spills, a few incidents in which I went wide, and a few
run-ins with the grass. This car is very fun though. It drifts very nicely, has
great speed, and look sexy to boot. Kind of reminds of the NSX. My first lap was
7'59.xxx (I never record it, and the times within my top 10 are always greater)
and my second lap was a 7'36.xxx (I'm not sure positive). I love this car. I
think I'm gonna take it around for a few laps on N's. I would also love to get
one of those Logitech Driving Force 2's (whatever it's called) but I don't
really have 150$ to shell out on a driving wheel right now. Great stuff though.
Excellent choice for WR™.
---
My GT4 Pictures:
pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/slinky25252/album?.dir=/9bfd&.src=ph

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/13/2005 6:36:53 PM |

I think I may have messed around with the Spirra at some point in the past.
Regardless, I'll try to get it out either Friday or Sunday. Same for the Jag,
which I intended to take out yesterday or today, but putting in 13 hour days at
work tends to cut into one's GT time.
---
From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/13/2005 6:48:05 PM |

I just ran this car around the track a couple of times with N3's and my times
were...
The N3 Test
Lap 1: 8'08.285 - A couple of big spills.
Lap 2:7'52.426 - Great lap, very few mistakes...
Lap 3: 8'10.201 - Horrible lap... tons of big and small mistakes

The Proto is a very scary car to drive on this course. Squirelly car + power +
'Ring = Death Machine. That's the only way to describe this ride. It's awesome
as hell, but hitting the grass with even one wheel at high speeds is a sure fire
way to spin out. I'm not really used to drifting with my cars (I loveee grip)
but this was definately a fun ride. Being able to just slide into a drift, and
throttle through the rest of a corner is an awesome thing in this car.

There are a few things you don't want to do with this car. For example, when
you're drifting on the outside, to straighten out the car only lightly tap
inside. This car tends to oversteer a lot, so throwing the wheel to the right is
going to spin you out. When you're on the fast hilly sections of the 'Ring, make
sure you've got complete control of the car. If you don't by the time you get to
a downhill decline you should be expecting a few hundred degrees of spin coming
your way.

There's really not much I can say about this car. It's awesome to drive on N3's,
is really fun to slide around the ring, and overall is a really great car. If
you haven't done so already, I really suggest you trying it out using N3's.


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:33:02 PM |

I paid $105 for my DFP on Ebay.

Oh, I got around my first lap in 8'20 on just reflexes alone with only one spin
at the bottom of the hill from Brunnchen into Pflanzgarten I.

Haven't driven much in a long time.

Just instincts of tossing the wheel to one side and feathering the throttle made
some wicked replays though.

It can get wild to straighten out, and this is coming from me, Mr. Sideways.
---

From: Syleus | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:36:09 PM |

mmm... the Spirra is delicious. Yum.

There are certain cars that bring a maniacal grin to my face on the first lap as
I mow the lawn, carom off the armco and spin like mad. The RUF Middlefingerbird
and Btr, and the Shelby Cobra and AC 427 are some prime examples. Somehow,
despite being beyond my abilities to control, they manage to be desperately fun.

I've only run it on N2s with 55 kg of neutral ballast on board, and it's great
so far. I took it out with the intention of just running a lap or two before
getting back to work, but I'm on my 5th lap already. Best so far is an 8'15"
with the potential of an 8'05", but on N2s I don't care about times so much.
It's all about getting around the corners and keeping it on the road.

Now, I'm a grip driver above all and don't seek drifts, but the Spirra demands
it. A combination of lift-throttle oversteer and throttle-on oversteer make this
beastie a sideways driving machine. Great, great car.

I like the looks of it too. The only bad angle is dead on from the front, but
other than that I think it's a very handsome car. Not gorgeous, but very
handsome.

Back to the track! Time for some S2 laps.

Oh, and it's great to see you back in your thread, sackedagain. I love reading
your posts. Sorry to hear that things haven't been going so well.

---
For sweetest things turn sourest by their deeds:
Lilies that fester smell far worse than weeds.

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:37:51 PM |
Whoops. Wrong account.

---

From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/13/2005 7:53:13 PM |

In response to Oni's post...
I really hate that Pflanzgarten area. It's definately the scariest and most
nerve racking portion of the track for me. It seems that if you don't brake just
before the incline, you're pretty much doomed to getting some air, landing in an
awkward angle, and getting a few hundred degrees of spin thrown in your face. I
personally hate it.

As far as turning and throttle goes with the DFP, I wouldn't know. When I say,
"Adjust very lightly," for a DFP that could mean, "Slam the wheel all the way to
the right and adjust like you just downed a whole bottle of 'roids!!11!!" And
yea, this car is really a beast to tame. Sometimes out of a corner I get into a
battle with oversteer, and it's probably been a 50/50 situation for me, I win
some, I lose some. I like to slightly adjust though. Tap the joystick to the
opposite side a bit, and keep it straight without having to worry about it
spinning out.

I really want a DFP, but until I get some sort of job, I don't think that's
going to happen. There's a few things I want to get beforehand surround sound
for one. I have a feeling it's a lot harder to drive with the DFP then a
controller, but it looks to be a lot more fun and obviously more realistic.

I think Sackedagain should post more often. His posts are very enjoyable, and
it's always great to see the originator in one of those greatest threads, if not
the greatest thread, to appear once in a while. I'll probably get around to
driving the RR later this weekend, it sounds fun.
---

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/13/2005 8:15:20 PM |

Yowza. I just managed to drift Miss-Hit-Miss successfully for probably the first
time ever. At least 15-20 degrees off-line to the direction of travel the whole
way through. Rubber screaming, frantic tiny touches on the stick. Of course, I
managed to ruin that lap by messing up Eschbach, dumping it in the sand at
Brunnchen and skittering through the fast run after the Pflanzgartens. I was on
my way to a 7'30something too. Ended that lap at a 7'42"

The Spirra is very very touchy on the countersteer, that's for sure. Anything
more than needed results in a quick nose-first trip into the Armco.

Great car. I had to abruptly terminate my last lap and shut down the PS2,
otherwise I could easily spend another hour or more just circulating around the
Nordschleife.

I'll probably fire it back up later tonight after I get some acceptable amount
of work done.




From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/13/2005 10:17:04 PM |

Proto Motorsports Spirra

It took me a while to find it. I think I looked everywhere BUT Korea half a
dozen times before I finally found it. But it was worth the wait.

Most definitely a fun car. My first lap was terrible. I was expecting some
power-off oversteer to help me set up for the drift through the corners. I
eventually learned to just brake gently and early and then power-slide it
through the turns. Gentle braking and gentle steering input on exit is a must.

It turned out that my third lap, which was cautious but clean, was my fastest at
a 7'43. I had several laps after that which started out much faster, but this
car DARES you to push it just a little harder than you know you should! "Can I
hold off an extra half a second before braking into Angstkurve?...Damn! I guess
not." And so on and so forth. It is not one of those cars that is forgiving if
you catch a little grass with one tire.

I found the entire section before T1 to be the most fun. The "brake, turn, gas,
slide...easy on the steering as the tires catch, rinse and repeat" dance made be
feel like a master of the drift. But then the Pflanzgarten "straight", and the
last few curves before the S/F line under hard braking reminded me I should
leave the drifting to those like Oni, who are much better at it than me. I had
about a 50% success ratio for both those places.

I know I could pull a 7'35 with it if I ran enough laps to put all my best
efforts on each corner together. But who knows how long that would take. I find
I have a harder time judging where the limit is on drifters than I do on
grippers.

The car IS a lot of fun! It is very comfortable in the midst of a drift. But
once you lose that fine edge of control, you'll probably find the armco before
you get it back again.
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/14/2005 4:17:54 AM |

Could it be said that the Spirra is faster than the driver?
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/14/2005 6:07:28 AM |

No, the CTR is faster than you are.

The Spirra just builds up such a head of steam that it feels like it's faster.

The way it holds angle just makes you rethink how you attack corners.

I don't brake much if at all before the last little jump into Pflanzgarten, I
brake hard when I hit to get the fronts to bite and then I lift and countersteer
my way around that double right.

Drifting Miss-Hit-Miss is an awesome accomplishment, I try to do it every lap in
every car.

Grats.

---

From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/14/2005 6:53:05 AM |

Spirra:

I'm likening this to the short, fiesty redhead of sports cars: a lot of fun and
a wild ride, but tempramental and likely to go crazy on you any given second
unless you play by her rules.

I've never been much of a drifter, so needless to say I found the Spirra a real
challenge. At times I'd be really enjoying myself, or, at other times, to
paraphrase that old song, "I fought the car, and the car won." I managed an 8.15
(as I said, no claims of being a good driver) on my best (5th) lap thus far, but
I'm pretty sure with more practice I could break the 8 mark.

The one thing about this car that I find the most difficult, though, is turns
following any sort of moderately high-speed downhill area of track - any slight
movement left or right and next thing you know, you feel like you're going to
ricochet off the armco and do a 360 or 2 unless you act very quickly and
decisively to get the car back under some semblance of control.

But she's definitely NOT a boring ride!

-Tim

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/14/2005 10:13:11 AM |

Anyone who wants drifting practice, go to Midfield Raceway, forward or reverse
and practice high speed drifts.

Then go to Trial Mountain for lots of off camber, hills, and a wide range of
speed drifts.

Autumn Ring Mini for low speed drifts.

Then try to drift every turn of the Ring.

Try to make your back tires trace the racing line, instead of your fronts.
---

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/14/2005 10:14:23 AM |

About the Spirra, DinSide Motor said:

Det har vært en tøff vei for ProtoMotors fra design til konsept og salgbar bil
og økonomiske problemer har ført til utsettelse av markedsføringen. Siden 2003
har merket publisert spesifikasjoner på sine kjøretøy som ennå ikke kunne
leveres til kunde. Nå er de altså endelig ved målet: å få sin supersportsbil i
salg!

And informotori.com said:

A rendere ancor meno rosea la nascita di “Spirra”, si aggiungono anche le
difficoltà economiche della casa costruttrice, che costringono a ritardarne il
lancio sul mercato.

Now, because I can't speak either of these languages or in fact even identify
the languages, I can only get the gist of reviews: "Look out for that wall!!!!"

I've tried to learn two languages, Spanish and French. The high school attempt
at Spanish was difficult, what with the lack of studying going on in my very
smoky bedroom and the angst of not knowing a woman's touch.

The French attempt in my Freshman year at college (first time around) proved
even more futile. Blame it on the moon. Or, too much of a woman's touch.

Spirra--I'm thinking maybe it's a Korean translation of English for "spirit."
This car's spirit has tried to overwhelm mine. Fortunately, I am a glutton for
punishment. The Spirra constructively channels my darker side.

Got the orange one, of course. Maybe a darker color would have proved more
controllable. Really, there are all sorts of seemingly non-performance aspects
of a car that impact that car's performance. For instance, my cars always run
faster if I've cleaned all the fast food wrappers out of the back seat.

I did manage two clean laps just under the 8 minute mark. Both resulted from a
determined effort to Go Slow. Not a bad handling car with the mental governor
switched on. Even drifted the double rights at Flugplatz in an age-appropriate
manner.

So far, a good time in the Spirra. Maybe by Sunday, I'll be able to move my lap
times down to something a little more competitive.


From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/14/2005 3:46:45 PM |

It's funny you should say that, sacked again. I've often felt the right sound
track and a clean dashboard are the key's to any automobile's performance, but
nothing is more crucial than the scenery.

[vitg]

From: caterham_driver | Posted: 10/14/2005 3:54:24 PM |

Well, damn. I thought I'd left GT4 for good but one thing led to another...

I was playing Battlefield 2 on my PC for a few hours after work today and felt I
needed a break (and some food). While eating, I flicked around the channels and
found some Australian V8 racing to watch and it dawned on me that one of the
tracks on Forza Motorsport (Xbox) is a rip-off of Bathurst, 99% - the pit
straight is a bit shorter, so I came onto gamefaqs to post that. Then I saw a
post about what's the best car to use on the Nurburgring (on Forza, where it's
40% bigger than it should be). Then I wondered whether the Diary was still going
and here I am.

Glad to see some of the originals are still around (or back, as it appears. Big
hi's to Onikaze and Sackedagain.

I have dusted off (literally) my ps2 and found that Gran Turismo 4 is the last
game I played, many months ago. Looks like I started again as I'm down to 10%
completed but I had enough cash to buy a Spirra, so I got it. In green, of
course.

First lap (of ANYTHING in GT4 since about Easter) in the Spirra and got 8:17.
Died several times, which doesn't bode well - one of my aims for 2006 is to
drive the Nurb irl. One lap will do but I'll also be paying for a lap in the
"taxi" to see how it should be done.

Second lap was a beaut. 8:10.566 and pretty smooth (for a grip-driver) and I
know there's a lot more I can do with this car. There were a few places I lost a
couple of seconds to the banzai first lap.

Third lap, I lost it coming out of Schwedenkreuz. Understeered, missed the tyres
by a hair's whisker and hit the armco on the outside. Bounced left, into the
kerb at Aremburg and the car tried to vault over the tiyre wall

And that's where I'm leaving it.

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/14/2005 4:15:57 PM |

Welcome back Caterham! Your timimg is only slightly off, as we had the Seven
Fireblade as a WR not very long ago. If memory serves correct, all were pleased.

One last note on what makes cars go fast: in GT4, I can live with having the
wrong color car. However, I cannot drive a car on the wrong set of rims. It's
imperative that the rims suit the car. I found this to be especially true with
the CTR.

I second the nominations of Autumn Ring, Midfield, and Trial Mountain as
excellent educational tracks, and think it would be fair to add El Capitan to
their number.

Oni, thanks for the input on Pflantzgarten. The bend I can't get the Spirra to
tame (without slowing below 120 mph) is Schwedenkruez. If anyone is taking it
faster than that and can shed light as to how, I'd appreciate it.

My own attempts all wind up the same: spun out, smacked into armco, stuck in
sand at Aremburg(usually in that order). As a result, my best lap thus far is
7'50.
Peace.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 6:39:41 AM |

When you go off the jump before schwedenkruz, be on the far right, aiming
towards the rumble strip on the inside, go in straight as an arrow and let the
tail walk itself out a little on the throttle, be ready to countersteer and then
correct back straight in rapid succession.

Don't let the back wheels get into the grass, and get ready to brake hard while
still on the gas.

I can make it through around 135-140 I believe, cause I have trouble braking
enough to hit high 2nd gear for Aremburg.

I'll try later to see exactly what I do, it's just kind of a "don't be afraid of
it, ride the knife edge" spot.



From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/15/2005 7:10:35 AM |

Yeah, that sounds right. That's a little bit faster than I take it, but I tend
to keep a little "margin" where Schwedenkruz is concerned.

If you're gripping it, you'll be going in at around 130 or so; the line is
slightly different in this case (though in a drift, as Oni's stated before, your
rear wheels are following the grip line more or less). There's a second small
crest partway into the turn and your line should pretty much fall smack in the
middle of the track over it. IIRC there's a seam in the pavements right on the
top of that crest. The racing line meets the outer side of the track just as the
kerbing there ends, by which point you should already be on the brakes for
Aremburg.

---

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/15/2005 7:15:23 AM |

Schwedenkreuz is one of those places that I rarely hit correctly. I almost
always turn in too late, then take a crappy wide line into it. On the plus side,
I usually have a good exit from Aremburg (since I can crawl through the entry
then power out early).

Schwedenkreuz, Miss-Hit-Miss, Mutkurve (Happy, Amarynceus? It's not "Angst"
anymore...), and various points (depending on my ride) from Hohe-Acht to
Galgenkopf always trip me up. I've pulled a perfect line through all of them,
but never in succession.

---

I believe I have an untouched Spirra in my garage. I bought it for something
specific, tuned it up, then changed my mind and reset the game. I'll have to go
and check.

The only color I really like on this car is the Spirra Yellow. The rest just
don't seem to sit well on it, and I can't put my finger on why.

I firmly believe that aesthetics matter, and it seems several others here do,
also. On some cars, that means leaving it stock, including its ugly wheels. On
others, that means getting a specific color (Jag E-Type in British Racing Green,
for example). On just about every car, that means no wings. I can only think of
a few cars that don't look stupid with a wing on them.

For the Spirra, my sense of aesthetics dictates Spirra Yellow as the only
choice.

I might not get much of a chance to drive it this weekend, but I'll try to put
in a lap or two. I'm hooking up the internet to my house this weekend, and Xbox
Live is soon to follow.

I want to check out the online Forza community and see if it sucks as much as
I've heard. Forza is good on its own (great tuning and racing, mediocre
driving), but Live will either make it or break it for me. Plus, I've got a '73
Porsche Carrera that's sexy as Hell. I wish I could bring it into GT.
---
Oni- A little math for you:

Drifting through Pflanzgarten = Insane
Drifting = Onikaze
Therefore, Onikaze = Insane.

I'd love to watch some of your replays- they've got to be great.

With a little preparation and the right car, I can manage some decent drifts,
but once I break over the crest before the Pflanzgarten jump, I'm ready on the
brakes. I don't think my reflexes are good enough to set up and maintain a turn
entry over a jump.

Later.

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/15/2005 11:12:28 AM |

Spirra - This was definitely a fun car, but in the few laps I've been able to
run so far, I'm nowhere near being able to tame it. One lap I drifted Aremburg,
Wipperman, and Plantzgarten perfectly, but spun out at Bergwerk and a few other
spots that I'm not quite as familiar with the names. The next I corrected all
the previous laps' mistakes at the expense of visiting the kitty litter at
Aremburg and Plantzgarten and spinning out at Wipperman. In the end the best lap
I pulled off was an unimpressive 8'12. I plan to get back behind the wheel of
this one (hopefully) tomorrow. Mid 7's feel very obtainable if I can reign her
in.

Jag - Sorry viper, but I have to say that I hated this car. It would take a
complex calculus equation to figure out how many times I spun out in my one lap.
I simply could not get anywhere near to feeling like I had a grip. One lap was
all I had the patience for. Driving at these speeds on the ring is almost scary.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 12:03:44 PM |

My favorite turns to drift:

The entire track up to T1
Flugplatz
Schwedenkruz
Aremburg
Adenaeuer Forst
Metsgerfeld
Kallenhard
Werseifen
Exmuhle
Breidscheid
Klostertal
Steilstrecke
Hohe-Act
Wipperman
Eschbach
Pflanzgarten
Schwalbenswanz
Galgenkopf

Where those refer to complexes, such as A-F and Wipperman, I like trying to link
the turns as much as possible.

Very fun.

I tap the brakes just after hitting before Schwedenkruz, on the right side of
the track, and aim my car so my left tires are right next too, but not hitting
the rumble strip just past where it begins.

I don't steer, I just get the car to about 130 on N3's and let the back end walk
around, which carries me on a nice arc through, and then I correct it, and do
some heavy braking before throwing the left side into Aremburg and walking the
tail around through it.

I've actually linked those two turns before in an RGT with the D-Pad, smoking
the whole way...was awesome.

I try to play the turns up for the camera.

Wipperman on the Odd Laps (1, 3, 5, 7, etc) is awesome.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 12:09:02 PM |

Oh, forgot, 7'53.586 on N3's.

Booyah Gramma.
---

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/15/2005 12:37:49 PM |

Nice.

I had some fun running the Spirra around on N1s. Especially when I spun it
around by accident in the Schikane and just decided to go back the way I came.

One doesn't even have to TRY to drift going the wrong way 'round the 'Ring, the
turns do it all naturally. Great fun. Too bad one can't turn that flashing red
"wrong way" symbol off.
---

From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/15/2005 1:01:18 PM |

Hi, I'm back. It's nice to see the Spirra being so well received.

sackedagain - Nice to see our legendary founder here. I joined in the volume IX,
and am already an addict. The best thread I've come across!

oldguy wrote:
I eventually learned to just brake gently and early and then power-slide it
through the turns. Gentle braking and gentle steering input on exit is a must.

That's true. I'm wasn't very gentle with the braking anymore on my fastest laps,
but in some cases it is wise to resist the call of the wonderful power-off
oversteer and slow down earlier. There are many corners that I think are best
drifted wildly, but not as many as you might think. Braking early and powering
through turns also seems often the best way to go.

Mr.Sideways knows his stuff. I thought about quoting him, but I'll just suggest
you read his advice... and do it twice if necessary. He's right on the point.
I'd be thrilled to see some of oni's replays, too.

About Schwedenkreutz.. I brake beforehand, start turning a bit at the same time,
enjoy as much lift-throttle oversteer as I like (not much in an optimum
situation) and hammer the gas again, preferably early. While the throttle has
some stabilizing effect in this car, it does not straighten you out too much if
you don't employ countersteering. And that's the tricky part, do it late and
careful. In my BL replay, I went through at 125-130mph (the metric system is
used here..I hate conversions) but I have gone faster. In any case I drift there
a lot.
How the Spirra got chosen for this WR was I tried maybe 7 or 8 possibilities and
I couldn't decide between 3 of them.. Then I took a nap and woke up thinking of
Spirra. And, while sleeping, I had already figured out several (misleading)
hints for it so it was an easy choice after all. It is strange how nap dreaming
is so different from night sleep. Naps are more likely to provide lucid dreams,
too. Gotta love 'em.

My first Spirra is in Spirra Yellow, which seems to be the most popular choice
here. I bought a second one and tuned it, too. That one was blue. The blue
(whatever it is called) in Spirra selection is very deep. I like it. If I ever
bought a third Spirra it would probably be a green one. Maybe a green drag
machine? It could surely hit 9's even though it doesn't get N2O. The stuff is
best inhaled, anyway.

My Best lap was... ...ahem.. a 7'27.4xx, I'm not at home right now but I think
it was .464. That was very close, but I did lose some in Mutkurve and in the
3rd-5th bend after Karoussel, could have gone faster. But most of the bends got
a good line so going under that time would be very painful. I think it's one of
the best times I've posted.

I tried the Spirra with N2s for replays, and used a SR exhaust for sound, but
had a hard time controlling it. Didn't record times and didn't try to go fast.
I'm thinking about trying it with N3s, too, as it seems popular. Usually I'm on
S2 tyres.

For Pflanzgarten, I'm already on the 5th gear long before its due. From right
before the jump. A small tap on the brakes after it if it feels right. I think
the 5th gear makes the car a little bit stabler and I'll go through with 50-100%
throttle and minimal sliding. Pulling off any kind of drift there and not
kissing the armco is a remarkable achievement!

BTW, how do people get their videos on the internet? The photos are saved as
some generic graphic files, right? But how do I make a 10MB wmv out of the 40kB
file on my mem card? Do I have to have a digital recording device with SCART/RCA
input?
---
From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/15/2005 1:23:46 PM |

I got cocky and changed my my sig. I thought about it before but I wasn't ready.
now that viperinthegrass said it aloud and everything... There it is. I don't
mean to brag too much, but I'm proud of my homeland and I'm on the faster side,
so...

The next WR - I'd like sackedagain to have the pick to celebrate his return.

RR:
The Jag became one of my favs. I probably won't break my record in time but I
will use the car more. The stabile nature of the car can probably stand some
radical setups. Again, if you have any suggestion on the susp tune, it would be
appreciated.
---
Flibutz of the Flippendales - The Flying Finn of the Gamefaqs GT4 board.

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 3:46:46 PM |

If sacked doesn't want it, I have an idea for a car that all of you grippers
should have in your garage.

One of the most fun grip cars I've ever driven.

9'10 on N1's, 8'34 on S2's.

It will drift nicely on the N1's, but on the S2's you have to throw it around
HARD to make it slide, and it will carry absurd speeds through corners.

One of those cars where you just have to trust that it will make it through the
corner.

Instead of it being faster than you, it makes you faster.

Glorious car.
---
From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/15/2005 3:52:31 PM |

If sacked isn't around, oni will choose the car. If sacked hadn't come along I'd
have chosen oni anyway... Good?

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/15/2005 6:00:48 PM |

MUA-HA-HA! I have my own Internet! World domination is just a click away!

Sorry. I've gotten so used to having to go over to my parents' house to use the
'net I got a bit overexcited about having my own for a change. Not having to
jump houses should make things a bit more convenient, to say the least.

My cable stopped about 20 feet short of hooking the Xbox up, though, so that
will have to wait until payday.

Still no Spirra, though I plan to hit it tomorrow.

Later.

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/15/2005 7:11:30 PM |

Congrats MrPinstripes! I'm curious to hear your take on the Spirra.

[vitg]

From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/15/2005 7:20:48 PM |

You know what car is insanely fun to drift around with? The Alpine A310 1600VE.
Sure it's not that fast, it's insanely ugly... and you have to win it, but it
frikkin rocks at drifting. There's just something about it that makes it drift
so insanely well on R1's. I haven't tried it on N's or S's, but on R1's it is
insanely easy to drift, and with a turbocharger packs some decent speed. I've
only raced it around a few tracks (not the 'Ring yet) but I highly suggest it
for a fun little cruise.

And 'Kaz.. if you can drift Pflanzgarten... you're insane. Isn't that the
downhill area in which your chances off not spinning out in a decently fast car
with little aerodynamics. I mean... how do you drift it? Or am I missing
something and there's actually an area that's driftable by a sane person.
Anywho... I don't even know where to begin with your WR™ choice. I'm going to
say that it's under 200hp and handles very well though... for a start.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 7:27:14 PM |

Yeah, carrying speed is definitely key with this car, and it is under 200 Hp.

I'm sure Sacked will love it too.

Won't say too much more.

You know the right just after the T9 Marker?

I drift that every time, I usually drift into the right-left before it.

I drift the two lefts before the hill/jump, and I drift the two rights before
those, which have a hill/jump and a S road before them.

That is where Brunnchen meets Pflanzgarten I, II is just after the second hill
jump.

It is definitely the most nerve wracking part of the course to be swinging your
tail in, because it's VERY fast.

In some cars I used to wind up pinballing around the track just past T9, cause
you pick up to around 110-130 in many cars.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/15/2005 8:35:43 PM |

Oh man, I found a car even better...

It is almost the same exact car, but the numbers would suggest it wouldn't be as
good, yet it would up turning a 8'26, and I bet I could do an 8'10 in it...

This car is amazing, if I didn't know better I would swear it had downforce, I
was going into corners at speeds I normally do and realised I was a full gear
too low, so I took the back half of the course a gear higher than I thought I
should, and with just a nudge of the wheel it powers right through.

Most fun grip car I've ever driven, hands down...doesn't hurt that I could make
it drift beautifully if I tried.
---
From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/15/2005 9:45:16 PM |

I have had a busy weekend Spring cleaning the House and working in the Garden,
which at about an Acre is not a 5 minute job, the Spring rain and warmer weather
is making everything grow like crazy, the weeds are as high as an Elephants eye
I am taking a break and have settled down with a few Beers to watch the Oz round
of MotoGp from Phillip Island.

WR™
Spirra Yellow
Got home late Saturday night after spending some time at my Sons 32nd. Birthday
party, too wired to sleep so took the spirra for a Fang. I had a great deal of
fun with this car, after many messy but fun laps, managed to get on the board
with an 8' 00.xxx then spent some time whittling it down to 7' 54.600 with many
near disasters, it sure is skittish if you put a wheeel on the grass. It would
benefit with a FC gearbox as I felt I was bogging down out of slow corners a
bit, probably too cautious as usual!
I am not normally much of a drifter but I managed one brilliant run from the
start to Aremberg in a manner that can only be described as “Sashaying”, really
if you walked down the street like that you would be arrested for soliciting!!
This kept me in front of my ghost and I was a bit more cautious the rest of the
lap which did not feel very fast, so imagine my suprise when I stopped the clock
at 7' 45.578 , although watching the replay I'd managed a fast line through
Bergwerk to the Karoussel and I had a really good finish too, sliding and
drifting nicely from Tiergarten to the end ( this alone cut 4 seconds off ).
I tried a few more laps after this but could not stay on the track ( trying too
hard, especially attempting to drift through wipperman a la Amarynceus) so went
to bed pretty satisfied with my efforts with what is not the easiest car to
control.

Oni – thanks for the tips on drifting, I will try to get some practice in as
time permits, so many cars, so little time!

Muse – baby MR's – MRkinder?

I will probably stay up tonight to watch the F1's then try the Jaguar again and
maybe my “special project”.
More later.



From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/15/2005 11:36:26 PM |
Thank you viperitg, MRkinder doesn't sound right at first, but it sounds better
and better the more I think about it.

Something I've noticed- if drifting is the dark side of the force, then the
Spirra is one of the recruiting tools.

Lots of 'Ringers saying "I don't usually drift, but..." and all the while the
Spirra is saying "Search your feelings..."

Once you've drank your cup of the Spirra, I recommend you bring out the Jaguar E
Type. I found my experiene post Spirra to be more satisfying than back when it
was WR.

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/16/2005 2:11:04 AM |

An era has passed. The V10s of Formula One are no more. We shall not hear their
wonderful scream again, I think.

No, it's on to 2.5 litre V8s for next year. Revving well over 20,000 and making
an estimated 800 BHP, they'll be interesting but they sure won't sound like the
engines F1 has had for a decade.

*sigh*

Hopefully next year brings some decent rule changes along with this dimunition
in engine size and power.

---
For sweetest things turn sourest by their deeds:
Lilies that fester smell far worse than weeds.


From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:10:45 AM |

*just a Sunday-morning mini-rant brought on by Amar's F1 rule-change news, and
perhaps a bit too much caffeine*

F1 is obviously the premium open-wheel class of cars in the world...as it should
be. But I remember a time (not so long ago) when it was rivaled by the American
CART series. Drivers often moved back and forth between the two.

I would love to see the ruling bodies of the IRL and (now called) Champ Car
Series get their heads out of their asses and re-combine the two series, or at
least standardize the rules and specs so they could compete together in the Indy
500. Both organizations have become a joke, attracting mostly second-class
drivers...all the best going either to F1 or (gasp) NASCAR, where the money is.
Names like Mears, Andretti, Fernandez and Fitipaldi are now on the lips of
NASCAR fans.

Drivers such as Jeff Gorden, Tony Stewart, Robby Gorden, Casey Kayne (sp?) and
Ryan Newman (amongst others) have made the switch from open-wheel to stock cars
for the money. I have to believe that (as America's most talented drivers) at
least one of those names may have made it to F1 if their paths had gone through
Indianapolis, instead of Daytona.

Unlike many of you, I enjoy NASCAR, having grown up watching local dirt-track
racing. But I would also like to see America's open-wheel series once again
receive the respect and popularity it once held. It was just beginning to move
to an international schedule when it went through its debilitating
split...putting a halt to those plans. I believe it would truly be a rival to F1
by now had that not happened.
---
The best laid plans of mice and men, often go astray.


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/16/2005 9:11:05 AM |

Tiny V-8's will sound neat, for example: Ferrari.

If American Open Wheel Racing had done anything but be nascar without the
bodywork, it might be impressive.

If they had moved onto road courses more, gotten away from that silly oval crap,
and maybe brought F1 over here fully, we would all be happier.

Instead it's a land full of people who honestly give a damn that Dale "I
couldn't manage a right turn" Earnhardt died.

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/16/2005 9:44:41 AM |

The Spirra is certainly a challenge. I must have sold my first one, 'cause there
were no Korean cars in my garage. I hopped over to the dealership and promptly
reneged on my previous color stand, picking up a white Spirra. Tastes tend to
shift over time, and the white one just seemed a little more dignified.

My first few laps were total disasters, as I re-acclimated myself to a
tail-happy MR. Lawnmowing! Armco whacking! Dancing penguins! Anything and
everything that could go wrong, did. Those of you who mentioned that the tires
MUST stay on the track have the right of it- once you drop a tire into the
grass, you're dead.

Once I learned to control it, though, it was quite controllable and fairly fast.
It honestly feels to me like the Ruf CTR would if you shaved off 150 horsepower-
compliant handling, good stability (if you know how to get it), and a little too
much power-on oversteer if you're not careful.

The ride was great- I never felt like I was bouncing uncontrollably (any Ruf) or
"mushing" around (most muscle cars), and the softish suspension allowed for some
fine adjustment of weight balance via careful brake + accelerator manipulation.
While by nature a drift machine, the Spirra takes surprisingly well to grip
racing once you have a handle on it.

My best time (N2s, oil change, driver ballast, no aids) was 8'08.2, with a few
more easy seconds here and there. For a car with a 3.7 p/w ratio (after the
driver ballast), that's pretty damn fast.

Leave it to me to grip with a drift car...

---
From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/16/2005 1:19:08 PM |

I'll show you grip with a drifter if I get the WR pick.

Oh that car is so in the Zone.

Hint: You have to win it.
---
From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/16/2005 4:03:46 PM |
Didn't you say you had two cars, Oni? What was the first one?

Those who love NASCAR have their reasons. Those who've seen it live know what
you're missing.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/16/2005 4:11:42 PM |

What am I missing?

The sound of the cars, ok, thats cool.

The speeds involved, ok, so its like standing by a loop of highway running at 3x
speed.

Nascar is as exciting to me as watching B-Spec.

I can't give away one car without giving away the other, but I will hazard a
guess to say that none of you have driven the second car, but most if not all of
you will absolutely adore it's handling/character.

Never have I driven such a tuned in car.
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/16/2005 5:07:20 PM |

I understand how you feel about it being as entertaining as watching B spec.
There's nothing I can say to make anyone like NASCAR who doesn't.

However, no gearhead/racing enthusiast/car lover would be disappointed live. The
circular format that disappoints on TV makes for an awesome racing stadium, and
I'll leave it at that.

I'm really, really curious to know what your cars are now.

Does anyone else feel like it's a rip off that RUF's can't drive in the Premium
Sports Lounge?

I feel like I have some catching up to do, having finally learned to let cars
slide a bit. Before, I'd countersteer at the first sign of trouble, causing the
suspension to unload and launch me into the armco. I thank the RGT and Spirra,
respectively, for helping me overcome.

I revisited the Berlinette today. That's a sweet ride. I bet it'd make for a
good race against one of the MG's.

---

From: jwrebholz | Posted: 10/16/2005 5:28:27 PM |

Yikes. Been outta here for awhile.

I've driven the Spirra before. All I'll say is that I couldn't handle it.
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/16/2005 5:39:19 PM |

Prize car, not popular, 9 minute lap times. Is it the BMW 2002 Turbo?

[vitg]

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/16/2005 5:51:11 PM |

No, but I do love that car.

9 Minutes on N1's.

8'20's on S2's.
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/16/2005 6:44:59 PM |

I have one more guess, but I'll keep it in my pocket for later in the week.

Has anyone driven the Nike One 2022 yet? I was perusing my garage, looking cars
which fit Oni's clues, and turned a lap to see. It's way too fast, but it's
certainly fun, with racecar like grip.

It has an 8 speed transmission and tops out at 160 mph, but it's so quick
through the bends that it's a natural ring toy. It makes for unique replays, and
is as fast as you are.


From: seebs1023 | Posted: 10/16/2005 6:53:23 PM |

did any of yous ever take the triumph spitfire around the ring? its a blast, it
has lift throttle oversteer and throttle oversteer, i spent most of my lap
sideways, and sometime backwards in the wall) on N2's ran an 11'05

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/16/2005 6:58:47 PM |

I've taken the spitfire around the ring. Neat little car.

I think the only place I've run the Nike is on the Vegas Dragstrip. Might have
to get that out one of these days.

---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:00:14 PM |

In the spirit of "foot in mouth", I went through my MusicMatch jukebox in search
of a soundtrack for a lap. The idea being to pick the songs first, then try and
match the time, without sandbagging.

First, the songs.

3:37 "Angels of the Silences" by The Counting Crows
3:36 "Where you get Love" by Matthew Sweet

7:13 Time to match. It's a very fast lap, but the songs have a led foot
influence on me. The question is, do this like a WR and pick a car that fits, or
like a BR and build a car to it?
The more I look at track times, the more song combinations come to mind. Or, for
long songs, did you know "Paradise City" by Guns n Roses was 6:45?


From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:17:19 PM |

Interesting idea! I can think of quite a few relatively long songs that are good
for driving fast..."Achilles' Last Stand" by Zeppelin comes to mind, not sure
how long "One Way Out" by the Allman Bros. band is, but that would be a good
one, and Metallica had several good lengthy songs from their earlier albums...

-Tim


From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:18:31 PM |

I think Inagadadavida Baby would be a good match for my lap times

---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:24:34 PM |

Dum-Doo!
Downownownownownownownow

Little angels of the silences
That climb into my bed and whisper

Love that song.
---

From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/16/2005 8:40:31 PM |

LOL, Souldarity...I have that one on LP and it takes up an entire side of the
album...though there was a shorter "radio version" that was released with the
solos cut out.

Oh, and I bet I could find a few good ones from my board namesake..."Voodoo
Child" in one of its live incarnations sounds like an interesting pick...

-Tim


From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/17/2005 3:30:18 AM |

The Spitfire is a great car, and I seriously considered picking it for a WR a
ways back. I figured our resident speed demons might not like it a whole lot,
though, and I try to pick cars that I think everyone will at least tolerate.

When the soundtrack idea came up the last time, I was thinking O Fortuna (from
Carmina Burana) would make a great intro for a lap. That's possibly the heaviest
piece of music ever written, and if Black Sabbath covered it, the world would
explode. I may have said that once before, and if I did, I apologize.

There's so many songs that could go great with a replay (no music while I play).
War Pigs, Miserlou (though it's probably too short), Interstellar Overdrive
(Pink Floyd at their heaviest), etc. Unfortunately the use of my PS2 precludes
the use of my DVD player for a stereo, so I can't listen to music and watch a
replay at the same time. Pootastic.

Angels of the Silences is a pretty mean song, especially coming from Counting
Crows. I tried to get one of my bands to cover it, but they wouldn't give it a
shot. No Willie Nelson, either. We did to an incredibly heavy version of
Interstellar Overdrive, and a pretty much straight cover of In-A-Godda-Da-Vida
(12-15 minutes, depending on our pace), though.

I, too, have my guess as to Oni's WR pick, and I, too, will wait until later to
hazard a guess.

Later.

---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:36:43 AM |

One thought I had would be to pick your car from the same country and era as the
music in question. For example, if you were listening to Pink Floyd from the
"Pipers at the Gates of Dawn" era, or Black Sabbath from "Paranoid", the E Type
would be an appropriate car.

Speaking of vintage Sabbath, I bet "Hand of Doom" is long enough for a good lap.


As far as songs that go on forever, one would have to include Jethro Tull and
the Grateful Dead. They could play a while, to be certain.

---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:03:51 AM |

Pretty sure I know what Oni's pick is, I'll bet its a GMC. But I could be wrong.

The Jag improved my best ever lap time but only because it made me have to beat
its time with my other class C race car. I had to add the fourth stage turbo to
do it though so awsome pick.

Unfortunatly I'm in the same boat as Pinstripes as my PS2 is also my stereo so
no sountracks but I'm thinking if I could, the entire Master of Puppets would
work just fine.

Keep ringing it All so I have something good to read on break at work.
---

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:10:19 AM |

I was thinking O Fortuna (from Carmina Burana) would make a great intro for a
lap. That's possibly the heaviest piece of music ever written, and if Black
Sabbath covered it, the world would explode.

So I'm not the only one to ever think this.

Now just imagine what would happen if Disaster Area covered it...

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:17:40 AM |

P.S.

My best lap is a 5:34, aids on and 787B (black) on R3's. Just curious as to what
you great ringers can pull as my best still isn't a totally clean lap.
---

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:17:49 AM |

So it seems my Jag was met with mixed results... I am still scratching my head
how someone can not complete a lap without spinning out in this car.

In general I am not very good at this game and had a hard time not meeting the
above characteristics. I didn't spin out until my second lap around(mostly from
a sense of feeling like superman or something), due to the way it seems to be
able to counter every mistake I make. A light tap on the brake here, letting off
the throttle there, and you are back from the brink of a serious problem. Oddly
enough I never tried putting the stage 4 turbo in it. I might add that and see
what happens.

Happy ringing folks.

p.s. I still haven't given up on my FIM time of a 6:30 car... I just haven't had
time to complete it yet.
---

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:11:53 AM |

Well, I think I was the only one that had problems with the jag. I know a number
of people take off driving aids and add ballast (I'm one of them), but I don't
think everyone does. I'm not sure if that contributed to it or not. All I know
is that everyone talked about how the Jag could practically pull itself out of
any disaster, and it felt like the exact opposite in my hands. I'm obviously
horribly mishandling this car, but I have no idea what to do to fix my problem.

---

From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:14:56 AM |

Black Sabbath “Paranoid” & E Type Jag OH YEAH !!

RR™ - Jaguar XJR9

So I settled in Sunday night to watch a replay of the F1 race, the end of
another era ( I have seen a few now ) its a pity this race was at a blahh track, oh well.
I then got to work with the Jag ( long thoughtful pause ) -
I really do not know what to write or think about the Jaguar, was it fun? yes &
no. Was it satisfying? yes & no. After starting at least 30 laps and only
completing about five it was, I decided, mildly frustrating.
But oh! When I got it right it is glorious, it is just that everything happens
really quickly, make a slight mistake and the Jag will turn round and give you a
swift kick in the midichlorians. Like all the über missile I have driven it is
too fast for me but what the hell it is fun ( but scary ) trying.I did some
fiddling with the set up and dropped my time to 6 ' 03 .129 with only a couple
of minor mowing expeditions.
A bit more fiddling with suspension and gearbox gave me setup I liked. My first
clean lap is a landmark for me as I broke the six minute barrier for the first
time, 5 ' 56 . 004
I find with these types of cars that “more haste, less speed” works for me i.e.
as I approach “trouble” spots I back off and coast to the braking zone or bumpy
bit instead of hammering it right up to the last possible second, I dont know if
it is because the wheels and suspension are not loaded up as much or not ( I
have not really explained myself very well but I think you get my drift). I had
one lap where I got as far as Galgenkopf five seconds up but put a wheel off the
edge on the exit of the first right hander and spent an eternity getting it back
on the track. Every other lap I washed out well before this because of losing
time in the grass.

Thanks for your selections Viperx2002 and Flibutz but of the two cars I think I
learnt more and had more fun with the Spirra ( but I did crack six minutes with
the Jag though !! ).

Flibutz, for what its worth here are the settings I used, hope they are useful.
I still have a lot to learn about setting up. I was pretty good in GT1 & 2 but 4
seems quite different.
Setup F R
Springs – 15.8 / 15.8
Ride Height – 60 / 60
Damping – 6 / 8 , 6 / 8
Camber – 3 / 3
Stabilisers – 6 / 6
Brakes – 5 / 3
Gearbox 1st. - 3.045
2nd. - 1.895
3rd. - 1.310
4th. - .995
5th. - .795
Final - 3.100
Downforce – 63 / 88 ( back off 10 – 15 % for more top speed on Dottinger Hohe)


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:23:00 AM |
No, it is not a GMC.

It is not from America or Japan.
---

From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:28:41 AM |

I just noted that the Nike one 2022 got a mention, so naturally I had to go for
a lap.
I was very gentle with it as I was afraid to hurt it because its alive! That
freaky heartbeat sound and what sounds like a flock of birds following it - very
odd.
Drives well though, will do more laps tomorrow.
I am not a big Disco fan, but I thought "Staying Alive" the Bee Gees would be
appropriate for the XJR9, but I am not sure how long it goes, but close I think.

Catch you all later


From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:31:07 AM |

I declined to take the Jag for a run because I recently had it out on the Ring.
I was testing out several of the Group C cars for a possible run at the F1
Championship Series with a non-F1 car.

I thought the Jag handled very nicely, and ran laps in the low 5'50's. I didn't,
however, find it on par with the Audi R8 or the Nissan R92CP. I could run low
5'40's with each of those.

Fed76--My very best lap on the Ring is in the F1 at a 5'19. Very scary!! The car
is capable of more...but I'M not.
---

From: Von | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:31:28 AM |

Not from USA? Could be a GM. Not from Japan? Could be a Honda, but then itd be
from america... lets venture a guess to say its not from austrailia or korea...
I dont think it will be a jag or alpine... hmm... a BMW?
---
Tiny subaru versus gigantic german deathring!-Amarynceus

From: Von | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:33:19 AM |

As to the question someone posted about the fastest Nurb lap times, I believe
someone around here did a 5:03 in a Sauber, and I think there was a video of a
guy with a Formula Gran Turismo doing a sub 5 minute lap, but I think he was in
Arcade mode, where you can beef up the horsepower and stick it with R5s...

---

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/17/2005 7:26:58 AM |

Flibutz, thanks for the nod. If no one objects, I'll yield my pick to my eager
young friend, (kami)onikaze.J

From: jwrebholz | Posted: 10/17/2005 12:38:09 PM |

A nigh-impossible challenge would be to try finishing an entire lap within the
duration of Bohemian Rhapsody. You think it's pretty long, and for a song it is.

It's 5 minutes, 56 seconds. I know I'm not good enough to pull that off no
matter WHAT car it is. Even my B-spec driver isn't good enough. I think only the
Formula One is capable of approaching those kind of times on the 'Ring, and then
only by the best drivers.
Of course then there's almost anything off "Train of Thought" by Dream Theater.
I think the shortest track is 7 minutes. I bet I could get a Camaro around in
the time it takes to run the opening track, "As I Am". Runtime 7 minutes 47
seconds.
It's not the fastest car in the game by any stretch, but I drive it often and
I'm extremely comfortable with it.
---
I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that you're a moron.

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/17/2005 1:10:20 PM |

Sacked, you will love my pick.
Here's another hint, this one MIGHT give it away if you're dilligent.

It only comes in Black.

[vitg]

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/17/2005 1:31:38 PM |

That means I was wrong. Good thing, too, as the Alpines really pissed me off.
The A110 was one of my favorites in Sega GT 2002, but really bites the big one
in a game with better physics. I should drive them again, though, now that I've
learned how to deal with oversteery cars.

On the other hand, I think I've got Oni's pick sussed (again). If I'm right,
it's a beautiful car.

---

I see we have some classic rock fans lurking here. I'm not entirely surprised.
Birds of a feather and all that.

Muse- You'd really have to find the right car for Hand of Doom. I can't think of
any offhand that would match the pace and ominousness of that song. It would
have to be dark, too. Maybe a midnight blue or ebony black.
I could go through the entire Ozzy-era Sabbath catalog and probably use the
whole thing for soundtracks to one thing or another (except Technical Ecstasy- I
don't have that one). I do so love Sabbath.
Amarynceus- The whole universe would explode. Except I don't know if Disaster
Area were supposed to be heavy, or just loud.
---
"Why not just make 10 louder?"
"But these ones go to 11!"


From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/17/2005 1:56:26 PM |

You know what car I'd highly suggest taking out for a spin? The Suzuki GSX-R or
something around there. It's awesome looking, has high rpms, and handles like a
beast. You have to win it from the Suzuki dealership thingy. It's really awesome
though.
---
From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/17/2005 3:49:03 PM |

Oni I think you've given it away. Secret's safe with me though.

"Hand of Doom" is the AC Cars 427 S/C, if you pick the right color.

---
From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:13:38 PM |

I see we have some classic rock fans lurking here. I'm not entirely surprised.

I love good classic rock. Actually, I just love good music in general,
regardless of genre and era.

And I've had Inagaddadavida stuck in my head ever since it was mentioned in this
thread... even with Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier played by Gould in the
background right now, the song runs through my brain.

Except I don't know if Disaster Area were supposed to be heavy, or just loud.

Both, I think. Adams certainly described them as if they were a typical metal
band... and yes, I think it would destroy the universe. At the least, a galaxy!
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:34:09 PM |

If you think you know what it is, give it a drive, see if it's as "in the zone"
as I said.

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:34:30 PM |

Just out of curiosity, as we wind down another volume of the ring diary, what's
the story behind your names? Some seem pretty straight forward (oldguy1957 comes
to mind), but some, like Onikaze and Amarynceus, are not.
Mine comes from one of my original online handles, from when I started playing
Starcraft years ago. SoulReaver24 ( I ripped off SoulReaver from the Legacy of
Kain game series, as I thought it sounded cool at the time. 24 was my age that
year) I eventually got bored with the name, but was so used to being called
"Soul" for short, that I started looking for a word that it could easily be
substituted into. Solidarity came to mind, and this handle was born. Probably
less interesting than some of the names on here, but there it is.

As for this weeks WR, lets just say that there's an overly obvious answer for
what Oni would pick and there happens to be a prize car that I've only won in
black (with gold wheels if I remember correctly) that fits the bill.

---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:46:36 PM |

Honest truth?
I came up with this handle years ago because it was gender anonymous. I was
somewhat new to the internet, and wanted avoid being "prejudged" in AOL
chatrooms (back then AOL was my only internet experience, and you could actually
have civilized conversations in chat) and on IM. Gamefaqs is the only place I
still use this handle. My name is Ken.
---

From: OCAdam | Posted: 10/17/2005 4:48:40 PM |

I have an idea...

Cassandra Gemini by The Mars Volta

AND

Is there a SLOW enough car to do a 31:42 lap? ROFLMAOOL!!!!!!!!!
---
When I get that Desert Eagle, I'm gonna go hunting random people. And all their
cars are belong to me! Don't kill me.


From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:10:29 PM |

My handle came from when I was poking around my Greek mythology books (Grave's
translation of various tales, as well as Homer [Lattimore's translation])
searching for names to play with in some stories I've been working on.
"Amarynceus" means "swiftly darting" and after I failed to find a use for it in
writing, it was chosen as a hopefully apt description of my GT4 driving.
Initially, there was a lot of darting swiftly... straight off of the road!
Nowadays I can almost live up to the moniker. On a good day at least.

Fortunately it shortens to a handy "amar" which actually happens to have 3
letters in common with my real name. And it's a hell of a lot better than some
of the GameFAQs handles I've had in the past.

Like "PlagueWinds" ... that was pretty silly. That was at the same time I was
playing tons of PSO and all of my characters were named after virulent diseases.
Malaria and Dyptheria spring to mind... I've forgotten the rest.


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/17/2005 5:32:32 PM
|
Oni Kaze, Wind Demon.

I drive like a demon riding a whirlwind.
---

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:43:52 PM |

Heh. Mine was from my younger days(I think I was 17) and I thought the name was
cool... I'm older now(22) and kind of regret it but my karma is so high that I
am remiss to make a new name...
---

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/17/2005 6:47:37 PM |

'90 Corvette ZR-1 and a Joan Jett medley: Bad Reputation, Do You Want to Touch
Me?, I Hate Myself for Loving You, Cherry Bomb, and I Love Rock and Roll.

I don't care how it times out, that chick and that Vette rock.
---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/17/2005 7:08:08 PM |

Well my name is much less inventive than ya'lls, first 3 letters of last name,
year of birth.O well first thread ever so still learning.
I agrea that the WR is black with gold tires and its a great pick.
I spent my last day off trying to keap the F1 on the ring and after countless
laps I'm down to 5:16.002. I'm not very happy with that and I plan on trying
till I can't beat that darn ghost anymore.
Dont want to sound pushy but isnt there supposed to be a new RR announced today,
you should know what I'd pick by what I did today so hopefully someone with
imagination has a better idea.
Also someone said the diary was winding down is there a limited amount of posts?
Damned rookies.
---

Only 500 posts per topic are allowed, so volume X is nearing its end. No worries
though. When it hits 500, someone will start volume XI to take up the torch.

As for the RR, from what I've gathered they're the least common of the weekly
challenges. We have a WR every week, a BR nearly as often, and a RR whenever
someone has a good idea.

But I can suggest the Subaru Impreza Super Touring Car for this week's RR if
nobody has a better idea brewing. I'd be curious to see where my lap times in
the 24 hour endurance stand up to some of the veterans. It can be won in the
Race of Pleiades (or was that Stars of Pleiades?) one make race for Subaru.

---
From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/18/2005 3:30:38 AM |

My handle I stole from a short story a friend of mine never got around to
writing. I can't remember anything about the character, but I thought the name
was cool.
Oni- Yeah, your pick is a really nice one. I had to go win a second one because
I changed the oil and put new wheels on the first and wanted an untouched one,
too.
Later.

---

From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:45:40 AM |

If the WR is what I think it is, I'll have to go win another one, too. I've made
too many mods to my current one to try to undo them (including weight reduction,
which can't be undone). But that's okay. I'd like to have an unmodded one in my
garage, anyway.

As for my screen name, while its origin might be obvious, the reasons for
choosing it may not. Simple reason, really. While I was lurking, and hadn't yet
signed up with a Gamefaqs' name of my own, it appeared to me that EVERYONE on
here was a pubescent video game addict that didn't have a clue about real cars,
or even real life. I knew that all of them would consider me to be just some
"old guy", as I would have considered anyone pushing 50 when I was their age.
So, to remove any pretense, and to let them know that I have spent more hours
behind a real steering wheel than they have even been alive, I chose not to hide
behind a wall of cyber-anonymity ("Hi...I'm old!"), and simply state in my name
who and what I am.

Since then, I have learned that there are gamers more like myself who also
frequent this board...most of whom seem to be members of "The Diary"...and that
there's really no need to interact with the pimple-popping know-it-alls that
infest boards such as these unless I choose to.

I now wish I had chosen a more creative name, but haven't changed it because of
the karma thing. But I guess to me, karma doesn't really matter. So, if I think
of something good, I still may change it. I'll see.
---

From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:24:26 AM |

Well, I'm a guitarist in RL and a huge classic rock fan, and I love Jimi's
music, and my name is Tim. One day a musician friend started calling me Timi
Hendrix and the nickname stuck. I just tell everyone I'm the whiteboy
right-handed version who doesn't do acid and isn't nearly as good of a guitar
player. Heh.

-Tim

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:30:15 AM |

Oni, I'll need you to consider throwing the WR back to me next week. I'm working
on a twist that might be interesting.

I came to the boards for Madden a couple years back and my QBs spent a lot of
time on their backs. It does not refer to my ability to hold a job.



From: ciscrack | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:58:33 AM |

Hey all. I don't think I've chimed in here before, but I saw that it's getting
close to 5,000 posts, and now you're discussing each others names, many of which
I've been curious about. Mine, I have to admit, isn't all that creative. My
name, Cisco, the fact that I live in the middle of cracktown, U.S.A., and me and
my friends call each other 'crackhead'.
Oldguy- why change your name? We all know you as Oldguy. Why fix somethin' that
ain't broke. I think it's kinda funny myself.
---
Hey! Pancho stole my ******* whiskey
photobucket.com/albums/a282/ciscrack/?sc=1


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/18/2005 10:09:45 AM |

I was already planning to give you the pick next week.

Figured I'd give you some time to think about your choice, I understand that
your brain doesn't fire as fast these days.

So, looks like a lot of you have my pick sussed out, should I just come out with
it early, or let it wait for those who haven't jumped on the bandwagon?
---

From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/18/2005 12:59:40 PM |

Okay, Oldguy it shall stay. I just don't want you guys thinking of me as some
decrepit 90-year-old, or anything. And yes, the humor factor was also a deciding
issue in choosing it, which seems to be a theme of mine in choosing screen
names. My name for playing online poker is "fool57".

Oni--It wouldn't bother ME to have two WR's this week, considering the absence
of a BR. Perhaps yours could the mid-week rider, and sacked's can be the WR for
the weekend.

Just a thought.
---

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/18/2005 1:31:34 PM |

I won't mind if the WR is announced early, but I won't be able to get any
wheeltime in before the weekend. I suppose that means I vote for only one
"official" outing this week.

My guess may still be wrong, but I doubt it. Oni + nice handling + black only =
not very many choices.

The only other car I can think of offhand that only comes in black is the Buick
GNX, and I doubt if Oni would say that has good handling- far too understeery,
even for me.

Later, all.

---

From: jwrebholz | Posted: 10/18/2005 2:03:39 PM |

I LIKE the GNX, and even I'll admit--it's a tank. A big, overweight, floaty
American land barge with a lot more power than it really should have.

No secret to my handle. First two initials + last name. I'm not very creative.

Oh, and don't get Onikaze's name backwards. That really pisses him off. You can
probably guess why.

No idea what the WR is. You can only win it and it only comes in black. No clue
whatsoever.
---

[vitg]

From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/18/2005 2:37:34 PM |

Oni,
Got it, sweeet!
Muse & I have been discussing a name for these types of cars, this one
definitely fits.
My name is pretty obvious, "in the grass" was where I was spending most of my
time driving a Viper on the Ring, this was early on when I was still learning
the track. I was driving the Viper because they play such a big part in GT1&2,
and to be honest I like them a lot.
I signed on to Gamefaqs the next day during a coffee break at work and was in a
hurry, other names like "Tasmaniac or Tassie Devil" just seemed too cheesy, so
there you go.
My real name is Rolf.
I have lots more to talk about especially my special project, but gotta go to
work.
More later


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/18/2005 4:16:03 PM |

If I get a couple more people wanting it now, or knowing it, I'll let it slip
early.

If Sacked wants to do one later in the week that would seal the deal.


From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/18/2005 4:53:22 PM |

I was thinking the itch to drive and talk about this car might call for a second
WR when we actually get to the weekend. However, weekday driving isn't easy for
everyone, and the car is worth the wait.

What we need is an appetizer to help us hold off until then, because I for one
have a hard time being patient, and I already have questions and comments about
the car (took it for a lap this morning).

There's been an RR nominated, the Subaru Touring Car, and if someone has a BR up
their sleeve today's the day to let it rip.

I read a fascinating article about the Lotus Elan, found here:

www.lotuselan.net/publish/sports_car_graphic_1.shtml

if someone wanted to take the Elan for a spin, I'll wager it's the best handling
FR car in the game.
---

From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/18/2005 5:42:27 PM |

Budget Rider Idea

Take a Car in game, and try to duplicate as closely as you can a car which did
not make it into the game.

You have 50,000 for Modifications, the Car is free, try to match up the number
specs (weight/power-weight/horsepower/acceleration) as best you can, and then
let us know if you think it would be a fitting tribute.

Hell, thats the name of this idea.

T.I.N.T.B.B.R.I.T.I.O.A.T.

This is not the best budget rider idea, this is only a tribute.
---

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/18/2005 5:50:13 PM |

Nice Jack Black reference there. I'm not nearly knowledgeable enough on cars for
this BR. I wouldn't even know where to begin looking for accurate specs on any
vehicle I chose.



From: ReturnOCheeze | Posted: 10/18/2005 6:23:38 PM |

just took a quick read thru this, and i'm seeing some great stuff. as soon as i
get the ring unlocked (my old file was corrupted ::gah:: so i had to start over)
and get a suitable car (ditto) i will gladly take a spin on the ring and report
my findings.

---
**Better Than Nothing** Casey Casper Races For The Heisman
www.geocities.com/casperrfth/


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/18/2005 6:30:32 PM |

fast-autos.net/makes.html

Great site, pretty much any fast car you could want to make a tribute too would
be on that site.
---

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/18/2005 6:55:56 PM |

hmm, interesting. I may have a run at this afterall. I doubt I'll have the time
to try out as many cars as I did with the foot in mouth BR, but I definitely
have a car in mind that I'll be trying to match.

---

From: ciscrack | Posted: 10/18/2005 6:57:11 PM |

I've been taking a bunch of my cars out for drives around the 'ring lately, one
of which was the Nike One. That's a pretty fun little car to throw around the
track. What is that weird noise it makes, the Flux Capacitor? Glad I didn't have
to drive it IRL, I'd probably strain a groin muscle getting into it, then my
neck while driving it. I decided to try it for a sec. on a rally track, not so
much fun.
Since I'd already taken one oddball car out there, I thought I might try the
Toyota Motor Tri. car. This one isn't as fast as the Nike, nor does it corner
quite as well, but when I watched the replay, there's some guy sitting in my
backseat! What the hell? Is that b-spec Bob? This isn't driving school. Where's
my toast?!
---
Hey! Pancho stole my ******* whiskey
photobucket.com/albums/a282/ciscrack/?sc=1


From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:27:19 PM |

Before this game came out, I said to myself "I'd pay good money to drive a
Ferrari in GT4". A year later, after it finally did come out, I paid good money
for a game without them.
Can it be done? Can we create one? What base model to start with?
---
For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will
be the coming of the Son of Man. Matthew 24:27


From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:37:21 PM |

Didn't the Lancia Stratos have a Ferrari engine?

-Tim

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:45:36 PM |

I really would like the F1 to be a semiRR or whatever only cause after at least
a week of trying I cant beat a 6:16 with it for the life of me, but not like
i'll stop trying. I know that just in practice and on R3's like it comes, a 6:10
is totally obtainable.I've run "perfect laps" for my skill and with the F1, for
me Schwerdenkreuz and Schwalbenscwenz are dueable but never in series or on the
same lap. Just one perfect lap is all it takes. And if anyone can do it one of
you can.
Its only Tuesday so lots of time and I guaranty that I'll have time to do the
Audi and some.And hopefullly post some better coments than I've pulled so far.

Lately cars like Oni,s WR, for this weak (oops), and the korean car(sorry forget
the name)are just to slow for me. Fun to drive.But just nt what I'm into now.
(but only low pwered cars can I ride with the Aids off). But only because I’m
still not satisfied with my best lap with the F1. Push push push
Anywho back to work so a little less time for racing and drinking but always
time for the Ring or the Nurbergring diary. Tell me I spelled that right.
Sorry the grammer and spelling sucks but I'm trying to type and listne to the
wife at the same time and my spelling sucks. Not a writer like some of us
ringerss.

---
From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:50:07 PM |

Muse,
Ferrarri Porche, Lambourgini, etc... nead to be in this game but...
---

From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:53:15 PM |

something tells me fed has had a little drinky drinky

---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:57:24 PM |

More than a little Solude, so if a drunk asks what your best ring time is what
do you say?


From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 7:57:24 PM |

More than a little Solude, so if a drunk asks what your best ring time is what
do you say?
---

From: ciscrack | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:03:37 PM |

Miller Time?

---
Hey! Pancho stole my ******* whiskey
photobucket.com/albums/a282/ciscrack/?sc=1


From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:14:00 PM |

Bad idea, but, when I was younger and stupider
I'd boonie cruise, ie.. drink and drive on gravel roads. So now why not grab a
stock F150 and go for a rip. To bad girlies not included.

Wow, bad words will be stopped.


From: timi_hendrix | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:14:24 PM |

I'd tell him it's 5 o'clock somewhere?


From: Von | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:20:19 PM |

fed, a 6:10 is fairly easy once you get the hang of the F1. 5:30 is possible,
probably closer to 5:10. We have seen Saubers do it in 5:03...
---


From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:23:57 PM |

Well, if ever there was a place to drink and drive, GT4 is it.

I may get to the BR tribute, but for now I want to try the RR (Subaru Super
Touring Car), and to do that I had to win the Pleiades cup. I have in my garage
a Subaru WRX STE Version VI (6.2 mile used special).

I hadn't driven a WRX since I discovered the 'Ring and learned to appreciate
cars for what they are. Prior to that, I thought cars needed "tuning". Little
did I know then that I was destroying the identity of cars I would come to love.
Funny the illusions we keep, no?

As a side note, is there a latin expression for "a thing in itself"? I may be
translating wrong, but I mean "appreciating a car for what it is instead of what
I want it to be".

Back to the WRX- the quest begins with Tsukuba. Right away the WRX lets it be
known that I should throw it around, whip it into bends and track it through
with throttle. Some AWD's are fun like that. The rest only turn while they're in
the garage or after a car wash. I digress. Again.

So the WRX is fun, and aside from having to race Suzuka Full (my worst course,
by far), the cup is fun. Each race was 116 a spec points, and I had S2's and no
ballast. Thought I'd pass that along for you A Spec point farmers.

Once I'd won the Super Touring, I was too hooked on the WRX to not take it to
the 'Ring for a victory lap. Or two. I was not disappointed, it's a natural.
Once I find better rims for it, I'll be spending a good bit of time on the 'Ring
the WRX.

My best lap was 8'02, and I'd like to find 7'50, or get as close as possible. I
may try N2's and take the simulation plunge, we'll see. I don't think I'll be
adding ballast though.

As for the Subaru Super Touring, I couldn't finish the one lap I tried, due to
many fatalities. It's a good race car, but I was too dialed in to the WRX, and
not in the mood to "speed up" for race car driving.

The Super Touring is worth winning if you haven't yet, if only for the winning
itself, if that makes sense. Peace.

---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 8:27:12 PM |

Von, your right, I meant 5:10. Shoot let me doulble check here, 5:16.002 is my
best, 5:10 doable.

I dont have the net to prove it, have to take my word.

[vitg]

From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/18/2005 9:22:55 PM |

Fed--Just for reference sake, my best time on the Ring in the F1 is a 5'19. That
was on about my third lap. I really don't know what I could get down to if I
spent some time practicing. Probably not a whole lot better. It's just more
intense than I care to sustain for very long. I'm sure the car is capable of
faster speeds than I, as a driver, am.
---

From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 9:45:37 PM |

Thakns for the nod there old guy. I already had you quoted at 5:17, but who's
counting. So far with a stock F150 I'm 8:42,970 with lots of drunken
mistakes.But lots of of fun. Black car with gold rims is at 8:26,139 with room
for improvement.
Cool



From: fed76 | Posted: 10/18/2005 9:52:22 PM |

Oops, forgot to mention that its pretty wild that on turns like Schwardenkreuz
and Fuchsrohre, with the F1 if you just put on tire on the rails and lift it a
bit you accelerate much faster, to bad you start to loose control.

First ever smily face , oh thats 2
---

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/19/2005 3:30:57 AM |

My best F1 time was 5'06, and I had another two or three seconds to make up, but
never got the chance. To get truly fast times you'll need to tune the car.
---

From: Flibutz | Posted: 10/19/2005 3:51:11 AM |

RR:

The Subie clearly is a very good car, yet I have mixed feelings about it. I'm
having trouble keeping it off the inside curbing, and that often throws me off.
The fact that its handling is very different from the cars I've driven lately
probably contributes to that. My BL so far is 6'36.3xx. Possibly more on the car
later, if I get around to it.

------------------------------------------------

As for my screenname, it was made up in haste. There was a topic I wanted to
post in, and so I didn't want to spend much time choosing a screenname. I was
about to use Flip'n'Dale after the two squirrels that inhabit my mind and
control my choices in life, you know, classical good/evil side thingie with a
comic twist, but it would have sounded like I'm two guys so I just deleted most
of the already typed-in name and added some weird letters to make it sound
czech. My real name is Tommi (like Mäkinen).

My fastest recorded 'Ring lap is a 5'32.9 in a straight out of the box Minolta,
only turned the ASM off. This leads me to the soundtrack thing. In the spirit of
FIM, I'll try to match the 5'18 of "Kick Muck" by Ozric Tentacles. A modded Audi
R8 on R5s might get me there. Or maybe not. That kind of laps are too fast for
the my reflexes/my pad combination but maybe I'll get lucky and manage to keep
it under control for a full lap?

About drinking and driving in GT4, I think everyone who drives drunk IRL should
try it to see just how easy it is to screw up. Sometimes you can pull neat
looking things off, only to crash into the armco in the next corner. Anyway,
I've done one "good" lap when drunk. I was showing GT4 to my visiting brother
and used the R92CP on the 'Ring, stock. I believe I only killed myself once plus
wreced the car a couple of times, but pulled off a 5'50. That was after around
ten 4.5% beers. Maybe I should mod the R92CP to make the 5'18.. And I can always
try out my black F1 (for the first time) if all else fails.

The WR sounds fun, I think I know which car it is but I'm trying to resist its
temptation until the weekend.
---
Flibutz of the Flippendales - The Flying Finn of the Gamefaqs GT4 board.


From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/19/2005 5:27:22 AM |

Thats great, I tried out my WR car with Stairway to Heaven, and the song lasted
until I got to Dottinger Hohe.

The Entrance to Pflanzgarten was "and as we wind on down the road" *dun
dundundundunnununun*

Made it through Schwedenkruz only tapping the brakes and without lifting.

130 into it, 127 out of it.

Fun car.

Just for the record.

Ruf RGT=Close to a Porsche GT3
Audi Le Mans Quattro=Lamborghini Gallardo
Audi Nuvolari=New RS5 that might come out
Lancia Stratos=Ferrari Dino

Then there are cars where a specific model didn't make it in, but it had
different suspension, or turbo, or something.
---

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/19/2005 6:43:19 AM |

Oni, keep your WR for the weekend. My idea has a Budget Rider kind of twist.
Maybe I'll throw it out for consideration a little later if we still don't have
a Budget Rider.

From: CheezyMadman | Posted: 10/19/2005 7:14:12 AM |

i'm giving serious thought to taking my 225 HP 1990 Honda CR-X SiR to the Ring.
i'm expecting a 8'30" or better. i'll find out later tonight, after classes and
work...


From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/19/2005 10:49:15 AM |

I have no idea how you managed to pull off a 6'36. In 24 hours, and what felt
like a number of fast clean laps, I only managed right around the 7 minute mark
on a number of occasions. I suppose it only further serves to demonstrate the
canyon between my skill and some of yours.

---
From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/19/2005 10:53:06 AM |

I got a 5'20 with spins in the F1.

Like, three spins.

Luckily each time it managed to wind up back on track the right way, so I just
lost a little speed.

If I had an F1 again, I could probably break it down to a sub 5 minute lap.
---

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/19/2005 11:21:44 AM | Message Detail

The Miata Club Budget Rider

At the end of ‘70s, the roadster was dead in the United States. You might see an
MG or a TR7, but usually on blocks in someone’s driveway. These days, you see
roadsters everywhere—Z3s, TTs, Boxters. What happened?

In 1979, journalist Bob Hall begged Kenichi Yamamoto at Mazda to build a
roadster. Hall ended up changing careers. Over the next 10 years, at Mazda
Automotive North America in California, he was part of the team that developed
the MX-5 under Toshihiko Hirai.

In the US, the car has always been called the Miata. "Miata" is from Old High
German and means “reward.” In Japan, the car was called the Eunos to avoid
confusion with the bicycle company, Miyata. In Europe, I’m told that it has
always been an MX-5.

From 1989 to 1997, Mazda was scared to make major changes to the car. It had had
tremendous sales and enormous support from Miata clubs across the world. Mazda
upped the horse power in 1994, replacing the 1.6 with a 1.8 engine. But that
only compensated for extra weight.

After the 1997 model, Mazda finally retooled, with input from club members. The
second generation Miata carried on the look and feel of the original roadster.
The quickest difference to spot is the headlights. The first generation had
pop-ups, but by 1998 Mazda was able to use a smaller headlight to achieve the
same illumination. The badging also changed, with the new Mazda logo.

The third generation has stepped away from tradition. RX-8 fenders, roomier
interior. But enough said. Oh wait there is one more thing, ugghhh.

GT4 has nine models from the first and second generation. Forget the second
generation for now. For this BR, you have your pick of five cars, all 1st gen
Miatas. You’ll need oil and a Viagra to restore the car to original specs. Don’t
tune it any further.

Now, I agree, it is a nice secretary’s car. But trust me, or check out a Miata
spec race sometime, the car is a riot to drive. Great handling with 50-50 weight
distribution and has one of the best gear boxes ever made.

In GT4, the Ring replaces Mazda’s original test track: The Pacific Coast
Highway. Keep your revs high and avoid braking. For grippers, this is a very
forgiving drifter. Momentum at work. If you miss Bergwerk or Ex-Muhle or
Dottinger Hohe, all corners leading into hills, there is no recovery. Your lap
time may be off by 5 to 10 seconds.

You’ll find these cars in the used car and historic lots:

1. The original MX-5 from 1989. Steel wheels, 118 HP/6500 rpm and torque at
100.97/5500. There is a god-awful blue that I wish I hadn’t bought. Look for the
silver.

2. The J-Limited from 1991. Who knows J-limited means? I’m assuming it’s a
Japanese model. All the cars are right-hand drive. Mazda always releases a
couple editions. In 1991, Mazda released a special edition but it was available
only in British Racing Green and that car is not in GT4. I do think the GT4 car
has the alloy wheels option available in 1991. Same engine and weight as the
1989 model.

3. The J-Limited II from 1993. The weight grows to 980 kg and 1.6 is replaced
with the 1.8 engine. Oiled and refreshed, the car gets 130 hp at 6500 rpms.
Torque is also up to 115.35 at a lower 4500 rpms. The redline moves from 7500 to
7000 rpms. In 1993, the Limited Edition released in the states were “Brilliant
Black” with a red interior. They came with BBS wheels, Nardi shifters, Bilstein
shocks, a spoiler and a rear lower skirt. Only 1,500 sold here. That car would
be a real find.

4. VR-Limited from 1995. This car has a mixed interior, tan seats in a black
cockpit. Other than that, seems very much like the 1993 model.

5. And finally, the 1997 SR-Limited. I don’t see any major changes in the GT4
1997 model.

I look forward to your reports and observations.

From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/19/2005 11:43:46 AM |

Just found this link regarding Miata models. I was correct, these are all
Japanese models. The following is an english translation from a Japanese site:

www.aus-cartalk.com/tech/miata.htm


From: sackedagain | Posted: 10/19/2005 1:22:12 PM |

Just read the archived vol I of the Diary. Oni, Garaso, NeilsBohring,
cybersk8ter and IMHansen were the main characters of that volume. Also, I wonder
if amr was amar at that time? For the record, I believe this was oni's first
post on the reposted diary. The mods deemed the Diary off-topic, but I protested
and got it back up. Ten volumes later, still going strong:


From: Onikaze | Posted: 3/16/2005 11:12:27 AM

7:48:777 BMW CSL bone stock, drifting like a madman, on the sports tires it came
with and an Oil Change.

7:28:431 Ruf BTR on Super Soft tires, stock besides, also drifting like a
madman.

8:28:XXX in a bone stock BMW Z4.

Yet to have a full on lap in an M5 where I haven't clipped the Armco at 203 Mph
resulting in a 3 Km period of whipping around end to end.
---
Ruf BTR: Let off the Gas, Brake a little, Turn the Wheel, and Pray.


Oni has drifted like a madman through 10 volumes now.

From: CheezyMadman | Posted: 10/19/2005 2:13:42 PM |

first lap on the Ring, just now. in a little 233 HP (@ 7000 RPM) Honda C-RX SiR
1990:

9:08.3xx. a lot worse than i'd expected, but i did spend some serious time in
the grass. no spins, one short encounter with the sand, but nothing major.

the most amazing 13 miles of my life, thoguh.
..
From: Onikaze | Posted: 10/19/2005 3:13:31 PM |

I got the BTR down to a 7'24.

Got the M3 down to a 7'30 or so.

The M5 is now an old friend, 7'25's are regular.

Ironically, the WR I'm choosing prefers to ride just on the grip side of the
limits of adhesion.

My god it has a lot of grip.
---
From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/19/2005 5:06:56 PM |

This WR™ better kick a lot of ass if you're gonna make me wait until the weekend
. I'm gonna try to break some of your lap times while I'm at it.
---
My GT4 Pictures:
pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/slinky25252/album?.dir=/9bfd&.src=ph

From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/19/2005 5:48:30 PM |

Sackedagain - nope, I didn't start posting until Vol V or so, although I was
lurking and reading from the very beginning.

I like the Miata Club thing. Earlier this week I completed my collection of
Miatas as part of passing the days until the Black Cars came up again (needed
another 787B for a-spec point hunting). So I'll probably be taking them all out
soon. Have to earn some credits for all the rigidity refreshes ("viagra" -- I
like that ^_^) that I'm going to need.

Oh, and since we're close to filling up this Volume of the Diary, I'll take the
liberty of starting up the new Volume pretty soon.

---
For sweetest things turn sourest by their deeds:
Lilies that fester smell far worse than weeds.

[vitg]

From: CocaineReaver2k | Posted: 10/19/2005 6:10:36 PM |

I just took the M3 CSL out for a spin. Coming off of a RuF CTR2 I was expecting
plenty of understeer, ugly handling, and crappy drifts. What I was the opposite.
This car is great. It handles well, the tail is always with you on stock tires
(I'm sure it's great fun on N's), and it has great speed out of the corners.
Really fun car. It's like we were meant to be together.

My first lap with this car felt like one of my most clean laps ever. I exited
corners hitting the exit rumble strip just about every time. There were a few
grass incidents, but it was a very very good run. This is an awesome car. It
basically has some of the best grip in this game, no matter what you throw at
it... it will keep all four tires on the road. While that may not be as fun as
say the M5, it makes for great lap times.

BMW is really really amazing... 3 of my fav's, the M3, Z4, and M5 come from
them. I don't think there are very many other manufacturers that have 3 cars
that warrant some of my favorites (if any), so BMW is pretty much a god send in
this game. My first lap was a (BOOYAH!) 7'28.112, and I got a 2nd lap time of
7'25.764 (BOOYAH X 2!!!). There's still some room for improvement, but that's
pretty much it for now. Really fun car, in fact it makes me want to give the Z4
and M5 another run around the ring. I will save that for another day though.

---
From: fed76 | Posted: 10/19/2005 6:40:41 PM |

Wow, what a s***y day to be hung over. First day back on call and ended up
having to water wash 3 of the 4 turbines that I operate. Very tired and sweaty
job but i deserved it. I did however learn that although I usually cant do a
darn thing in GT4 if I'm drunk, once in a while, its not so bad. Its seems
especially when the only track that I drive any more is the Ring.
I hopped into the F150 that was in the garrage and went striaght to the ring,
good thing no red and blues on the root I took, but this one was much to
modified for my very slow reflexes. So over to Ford and bought one stock. I dont
recall exact times but pretty sure it was close to or over 9 minutes. The truck
handles pretty good but I sure wasnt.If a guy wasnt so tired today he might see
how much better he does sober.
Over all the expierence wasnt to bad and after only one or two deaths on the
first lap, okay maybe four or five, I actually stayed alive for the second lap,
just brushing the armco with the box a couple of times.
Anyhow I was just out checking things at work and thought while I wait for the
temperature to drop a little more here, I'd see if any one was bad mouthing the
drunk from the other day.

---

From: MrPinstripes | Posted: 10/19/2005 7:19:11 PM |

Inspired (or goaded, depending on your point of view) by CocaineReaver's pursuit
of Oni's lap times, I myself decided to give the M3 CSL a shot. The only M3 I
had driven was the base model, since Oxfordgrun Metallic handles so much better
than silver or black.

I grabbed a black one (I figure the GTR will be my silver M3, once I re-win it),
changed the oil, and resisted the compulsion to put my driver weight in. I found
that, for me, not having a "driver" is sort of like switching back to
whitey-tighteys after wearing boxers for a long time- while it's not really
uncomfortable, it just feels sorta wrong.

My first lap was a conservative one, mostly clean, with one damaging bobble at
Miss-Hit-Miss (I hit the inside bank) and one lawnmowing one coming out of the
Pflanzgarten run. Time: 7'27.6

I find my second lap in a car is usually my best. I have enough of a handle on
it's behavior to avoid trouble spots and push where I can, but I'm not
overconfident enough to push too hard. The second lap was textbook clean (though
it still had some room for improvement) and closed at 7'23.579.

My third lap saw me in front of my ghost through Aremburg (by 0.1 or so), but I
blew the entry to Adenauer-Forst. Pushing too hard, as usual.

The CSL isn't that much different than the base M3, just faster. I think the M3s
are probably the most "whole" feeling cars in the game. The entire car is just
perfectly tuned, and I don't think I could improve it if I tried.

I'm currently hunting for my Miata Club car (gotta get the '95 VR-Limited in
Artvin Mica Metallic!), and added another Cerbera to my collection (8 more
colors to go). I passed up another shot at the black LMP cars to buy it, too.
Oh, well. I'd rather have the real colors than the black ones anyway.

Later.

From: wanderingmuse22 | Posted: 10/19/2005 7:47:01 PM |

MrP, you rock. I am SO thankful not to be the only one with a Cerbera
compulsion. I stopped at Reflex Spice, but I know I'm not done.

Thank you for the Miata Club, Sackedagain. The Miatas are fun to drive, guilty
pleasures that they are. I confess to mocking them from day one. I also confess
to enjoying them in GT4. Yes, I am a hypocrite. But, I'm working on it.

We lost Volume IX to off topic deletion too. It's sad to see that people won't
let a good thing be. I didn't realize it had happened before though.


Page 50 of 50 The Nurburgring Diary, Volume X

From: viperx2002 | Posted: 10/19/2005 8:05:19 PM |

The Miatas are fun to drive, guilty pleasures that they are. I confess to
mocking them from day one.

I have always hated them aesthetically. They look like a girls car(no offense to
any girls about... are there any girls about? Meh.). I mean as far as the lines
go there is nothing aggressive(or as far as I can see assertive even) about it.
Don't even get me started on the colors. This is all leading up to a big but.
But in every game I have ever played that involves racing that has had the Miata
in it(GT3, NFS, and NFSU2) I have taken this car and run it into the ground. As
much as I hate it's looks it has always been a faithful companion when I need a
car that is cheap and can win races.
---
"The greatest burden is great potential" - Charles M. Schulz

From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/19/2005 8:31:50 PM |

G'day all,

I have today off, public holiday for our Royal Agricultural Show, sort of like a
State Fair thing. So naturally I have been ringing, firstly with the Suby
Touring car plus my special project, but more on that later. I am saving the WR™
and the MX5 (Oz name) BR™ for the weekend.
Last night I completed a few driving missions and won a Pagani Zonda Racecar, so
I put on a party mix tape and took it for a spin with the volume up very loud (
the windows were rattling ). first track “Rock & Roll” Led Zepp followed by
“Rebel Yell” Billy Idol. Fabulous! I got into a real rhythm even though I could
not hear the car at all, punched out a 6 ' 17. 655 with very few mistakes, great
car ( I ran it as it came).

Had a minor disaster though today, my turntable died! I will have to buy another
one. Are there any electronic experts out there who can tell me how to copy
records from a turntable onto my computer ( cassette tapes as well )?

Muse, how does “Unus Quendum Intus Sese” sound ( One thing within itself )?
the grammar is probably all wrong but that was the best I could come up with
late last night.
I know what you mean about appreciating each car for what it is, that is why I
generally try to have two of everything so i can keep one stock and one to tune
up to if necessary to be competetive in races (and win more cars)!
More later tonight

From: viperinthegrass | Posted: 10/19/2005 8:40:25 PM |

p.s.
Fed,
I would never bad mouth a drunk because that would be hypocritical, having
consumed more than my fair share of various nectar of the gods over the years,
particularly Beer which is very big over here.
As an aside, in Tasmania we brew the best Beer in Australia. if you dont believe
me come over for a visit and we will partake of that great Oz pastime - go for a
Pub Crawl.
Cheers!


From: Amarynceus | Posted: 10/19/2005 8:55:15 PM |

I know I've had my fair share of drunken Ringing. Just don't do it with a RUF.
>_>

Hmm. This Volume's almost full. I'll update the WR and RR lists and post a new
one shortly.
---
For sweetest things turn sourest by their deeds:
Lilies that fester smell far worse than weeds.


From: Soulidarity | Posted: 10/19/2005 8:59:25 PM |

As far as I can tell, no one bad mouths anyone else where the ring diary is
concerned. A little ribbing, maybe (my comment about having a little drinky,
drinky for example), but the closest thing to flaming or badmouthing I've seen
had to do with a certain someone who likely got the last volume of the diary
deleted, when he showed his face towards the beginning of this one. So, no
worries there, fed. Besides, I think we've all got our too many drinks nights.

---
From: oldguy1957 | Posted: 10/19/2005 9:17:41 PM |

As I was test-driving the Imprezza Super Touring Car, I just had an interesting
thought. My impression of the car was that it drives like a race car. Neutral
handling, and very good overall...like a typical race car. They all feel about
the same, to me. The times are mostly dependant on the "power to weight" ratio.

Soooo...thinks me, it would be interesting to know what the
power-to-weight-ratio to Nurburgring-lap-time ratio would be. And, to take it a
step further, I wondered if that number would be about the same for each of the
race cars of any particular class of cars (LMP's, LM's, JGTC's, Touring Cars,
etc.). Or even ALL cars, for that matter.

I would take the total lap time, in seconds, and divide it by the P to W ratio
listed in the garage, and come up with a number I would call the RTP (Ring To
Power) Ratio.

For example, I just ran a 6'51.656 (I only ran one lap, so I'm sure I could
improve on that at least a little...but anyway), which would translate to
411.656 seconds. The PW ratio is 2.445. So, my RTP would be 168 (rounded to the
nearest whole number).

I'm sure there is a formula like this, with downforce and tire grip figured in,
to come up with a-spec points. But by always running full downforce and using
R3's, those two variables could be eliminated. For production cars, S2's could
be the constant for the "grip".

Time for some experimenting...

Note to self:
Subaru Imprezza Super Touring Car RTP: 168

[vitg]

This Completes

The Nürburgring Diaries Archives Volume X